AA is a haven for liars psychopaths and criminals to prey on vulnerable people and make them confess powerlessness and then bully them into suicide. Of course, they pretend to be pious and ‘reformed’ but they are just as dangerous ‘sober‘ as they were drunk not to mention they lie like the wind and their ‘sobriety date’ is meaningless. Just because someone says “I was a born liar and master manipulator” doesn’t mean they are now the pope of england. More likely they are a bully who will distract you with talk of ‘god this‘ and ‘god that‘ and ‘dopomine’ and ‘seritonin‘ and meanwhile assure you that your resentments will surely kill you because “that is the nature of our disease” and counter any claim you make with the accusation of ‘ignorance‘, ‘arrogance‘, ‘crazy‘, ‘need professional help’, ‘liar‘, and ‘in denial‘ and ‘Your words may kill the still suffering alcoholic‘. Well if that sounds like fun to you then go ahead and sign up. Otherwise I suggest you stay the hell away from that psycho cult.
Whose members will now demonstrate their despicable tactics for all to see:
“Yes, of course, a ‘comprehension’ problem. Thanks I forgot that one. Any more I missed? If you don’t speak for AA, you sure do defend it aggressively with words.”
Yes apparently you did miss that one. No surprise really. I am but one of millions of members of the program and we have no governance in that program. Therefore I don’t speak for the program as a whole only for myself. So where is this so called proof of mischief? You still refuse to provide it? Of course you have none that is why you have yet to do so. Your lack of proof in your spurious claims brands you the liar I know you for.
Just go to any AA meeting across the country. Better yet, just recite your drunkalog and read it. Do you need any more proof?
Yes I need proof. You are liar and cannot provide that which I have asked of you. I have never in my 26 years of sobriety been to a meeting where anything you have claimed has taken place. So put your money where your mouth is.
Just click on “Meetings Blog” and you’ll have all the documentation you need.
According to recent statistics, AA and otherwise, AA attendance is estimated to be at around 1.4 million “world wide”. Most in the U.S. I guess us Americans are much more stupid than the rest of the world.
The good news is, that AA attendance seems to be falling. This is probably due to increased education in the alcohol field. There is actually scientific research being done that dashes that whole idea of praying to doorknobs is the only way to quit drinking.
“I love how you demand ‘proof’ of the insults and bullying in your cult in a comment full of insults and bullying. The astonishing and hilarious thing is that you don’t realize that you are destroying your “Christian/Blessed be/Confess your sins” cult in your increasingly desperate attempts to defend it. Thank you. :-)”
Not at all. But you are still a liar. You refuse left and right to provide any proof whatsoever which proves my point. I don’t speak for AA.
And you call people “insane, ignorant, in denial, lying, crazy and stupid” if they claim you do exactly that. (Or in Gavin’s case, “loony, stupid, liar, and terrible christian”.) And then like a good cult member you deny your membership outside your meetings. Thanks for proving the whole point of the article.
I did not deny my membership. I said that I don’t speak for AA. You have a problem with reading comprehension don’t you?
Yes, of course, a ‘comprehension’ problem. Thanks I forgot that one. Any more I missed? If you don’t speak for AA, you sure do defend it aggressively with words.
“Oh you mean I get to confess my sins at 12 Step meetings and then ask for forgiveness? Oh fun. Why didn’t you say so? You make it sound like so awesome. I bet everyone wishes they had a sponsor like you. Now I get why they say ‘attraction’ not ‘promotion’. I’m sure people are running to your meetings now.”
Well do it wherever you want. I don’t care one wit. I just know that for Christians they have to confess their sins to god or their priest or whomever. It is much like taking a moral inventory of one’s self, looking at their character defects and admitting they are flawed human beings. Do whatever blows your skirt up.
Oh you mean that people have to confess their sins and ask for forgiveness, and they can do this anywhere they want, and then people like you will make sure they understand they are ‘flawed’ and are a cross dresser? And then deny that AA is a nasty bullying cult full of people who gang up on people and ‘harangue’ them endlessly and then deny it? Oh my, I am going to look up my local meeting right now!
You are off the rails little mind. Off the rails. You rants are becoming the norm though so it is really no surprise. Just know that I know you. I know what you are about and I know that I get under your skin. And to be honest I kind of like that. I will be watching you. Make no mistake your lies will be brought to light. Until then, I bid you adieu. Have a blessed evening. I would say that you are a worthy opponent but that would be wrong.
I love how you demand ‘proof’ of the insults and bullying in your cult in a comment full of insults and bullying. The astonishing and hilarious thing is that you don’t realize that you are destroying your “Christian/Blessed be/Confess your sins” cult in your increasingly desperate attempts to defend it. Thank you. 🙂
My god told me to tell you that your god said, “I am getting really annoyed with Gavin constantly begging me to please strike down AddictionMyth with painful boils and hemmeroids. I tried long ago to remove his ignorance but no luck. I gave up but wow that Gavin’s a persistent little bastard. I hope he finds peace. And a better hobby than annoying AM all day and calling him a ‘liar’. His satanic cult will be fine, I don’t know what he’s so worried about.”
So no you are not going to provide any proof of your claim. Just as I thought. You are a pretentious liar. And a terrible Christian if that is what you are. Fear not I will continue to harangue you on your lies. Until then have a blessed day little mind. And tell your god he sucks.
“Terrible Christian”?? “I will continue to harangue you”?? Aw I bet you say that to all the newcomers. 😉
Are you a newcomer? I didn’t think so. You are someone so full of hate that you can’t see beyond your own ego. And yes if you are a Christian you are terrible at it. Perhaps you should confess your sins and ask for forgiveness. Ah but then that would be too much like 12-step programs.
Oh you mean I get to confess my sins at 12 Step meetings and then ask for forgiveness? Oh fun. Why didn’t you say so? You make it sound like so awesome. I bet everyone wishes they had a sponsor like you. Now I get why they say ‘attraction’ not ‘promotion’. I’m sure people are running to your meetings now.
AA is a satanic cult. If your a member your probably on your way to hell.
Revelation 18:4 – come out of her my people
For he/she is the true satan worhiper.”
“Apparently you have a conspiracy theory disorder. You truly think that the US government is wrong to wage a war on drugs even though the science proves the deadliness of this disease?”
“Blaspheme all you want but quit spreading libelous bullshit”
“We can’t let the loonies like addictionmyth and his/her minions keep us from spreading the gfood word, that there is a solution to this DISEASE.”
Do you need any more PROOF?
Touche. I did indeed call you crazy. I am only human so I indeed forgot. I suspect that you will deny calling me and AA as bad as ISIS and telling me to move to Syria? I suspect you will deny saying that I have bullied people into suicide without proof? Alas one cannot fix willful ignorance in one that does not want to have an open mind. The proof I am looking for little mind is the proof you claim about my program being a suicide cult and a drinking club. That is the proof. Provide it!
And then after proving the bully is a liar and presenting lots of evidence showing that ‘treatment’ by the cult greatly increases suicide risk, the bully calls the detractor ‘little mind’ and asks for further proof that his cult insults and bullies people into suicide and asks again for ‘proof’. Thanks, please continue with your demonstration:
So are you going to provide it or not?
So here is a response you gave to someone. I wonder does your god allow for lying?
You are not an alcoholic. There is no such thing. You can drink if you want. It won’t kill you. If you think you can’t then contact me and we’ll discuss.
If you have to go to aa then might as well do it and have fun. Just remember you’re not really powerless and then lie like the wind.
My god told me to tell you that your god said, “I am getting really annoyed with Gavin constantly begging me to please strike down AddictionMyth with painful boils and hemmeroids. I tried long ago to remove his ignorance but no luck. I gave up but wow that Gavin’s a persistent little bastard. I hope he finds peace. And a better hobby than annoying AM all day and calling him a ‘liar’. His satanic cult will be fine, I don’t know what he’s so worried about.”
“How about just reread your and CWWJ’s comments.”
How about giving me proof of your claim. My comments have nothing to do with bullying or threats unlike yours. Once again all you have to do is bring me proof. That’s it. If you can’t do that then everyone reading this blog will know you for the liar you are.
My proof is in every single article on this site, and in every one of your comments. You’ve been badgering me for over a year now and calling me insults nonstop, including ‘crazy, in denial, lying, stupid and insane’. And then astonishingly you deny it. Even though the evidence is right here for everyone to see. This is the same thing you do at your meetings to the newcomers. You are a nasty liar with decades of drunken mischief. Now you bully people into overdose and suicide at your meetings and hide behind a veneer of Christianity which consists mainly in calling other people ‘satanists and jihadists’. OK Gav, Blessed be.
Well first off I only found this sire a few months ago so badgering you for over a year is 100% lie. Secondly I never called you crazy yet nor did I say you were in denial. A liar yes. Once again you Fail to provide any proof of your claim. How many meetings have you actually been to? All of them in the world? No. Thirdly it is you providing the insults, character defamation and flat out lies. I only respond in kind. Perhaps you should take a sabatical to collect your thoughts and perhaps find the proof I have asked for four times now. You have provided only evidence of your own lies and bullying tactics. I have provided facts from the CDC, APA, SAMSHA, NIDA and other reputable entities for you to peruse and yet you say they are all liars. You get your misinformation from either High Times magazine or the Westboro Baptist church or both for the so called “facts” you provide and you cannot even offer one ounce of proof to your claim. As I said, this shows you for the liar you are. Blessed be little mind, blessed be.
Here ya go:
“For he/she is the true satan worhiper.”
“Apparently you have a conspiracy theory disorder. You truly think that the US government is wrong to wage a war on drugs even though the science proves the deadliness of this disease?”
“Blaspheme all you want but quit spreading libelous bullshit”
“We can’t let the loonies like addictionmyth and his/her minions keep us from spreading the gfood word, that there is a solution to this DISEASE.”
Do you need any more PROOF?
“LOL so far you’ve called me a jihadist and a satanist. And then you say you’re not challenging my religion? ”
I didn’t challenge your “religion.” I challenged you. You have yet to state what your religion is but by your very words you appear to be exactly as I stated, a jihadist. You challenge my program calling it a bullying suicide cult and a drinking club and yet you have the audacity to be pissed about me firing one back over the bow at you?
“You sound like a holy roller. Which by the way is a great advertisement for your cult. Where you call people jihadists if they don’t believe in your ‘disease’ theory. I’m sure everyone is lining up for a piece of your sponsorship.”
Call me what you would like. I could care less what you think about me but when you lie about my program you step pver the line. If you had anything of worth as far as true critique about AA, it would be one thing but you don’t. You are a liar and a potential murderer. Guaranteed that if someone with a fragile state of mind happened onto this drivel that you call fact sees it and kills themselves their blood is on your hands. People in the program can belive whatever they wish. The only requirement for membership is the desireto stop drinking. They don’t even have to stop.
Yes your religion is a bullying suicide cult and if anyone challenges it you go to their web site and call them a satanist and jihadist and then ‘liar and a potential murderer’. Thanks for demonstrating how it works for all the newcomers to see. Please, continue:
Around and around we go. Give me one proof where my program bullied anyone into suicide? Just one. If you can do that then perhaps your claims will have some semblance of veraicty. I can give you proof that your religion has murdered millions over the years. And yes the more shit you spew about addiction not being real the more you put people in harm’s way. So get me that one piece of proof.
How about just reread your and CWWJ’s comments. 🙂
Seriously? Are you now selling indulgences at AA? Wow.
Nobody is selling anything in AA. I asked you a question about your so called Christian faith. All you have to do is answer it.
I love how you challenge other people’s religious beliefs. And then claim you’re ‘spiritual not religious’. And then claim that you’re not a church but a ‘support group’ for a ‘disease’. You really need to figure out what the heck you’re trying to say.
No one is challenging anyone else’s religious beliefs but you. I asked a simple question of you, one that you dance around. My program is based on my spiritual beliefs and I could care less what others believe. If they even believe in a higher power. You on the other hand sound like a jihadist out for blood.
LOL so far you’ve called me a jihadist and a satanist. And then you say you’re not challenging my religion? You sound like a holy roller. Which by the way is a great advertisement for your cult. Where you call people jihadists if they don’t believe in your ‘disease’ theory. I’m sure everyone is lining up for a piece of your sponsorship.
Bill Wilson reported as an infamous 13 stepper. READ THE Addiction report on Satanism.
His dabblings with LSD after becoming CLEAN.
Is your group really anonymous or do you ALL discuss each persons issues and GOSSIP?
If someone. Leaves a group do you automatically decide they have relaps e d or gone crazy?
Are you just like a cancer victim…just because they stop smoking or eating unhealthy foods does the cancer just GO AWAY?
So do you REALLY HAVE A DISEASE?
When a person relapses hurt someone either emotionally or physically are all their sins forgotten…then why couldnt a murderer turn up at AA and be all forgiven and keep doing the same thing over and over again then pick up a WHITE CHIP?
Is AA really your judge and jury?
Why do people with 20 plus years still go to AA and have dysfunctional lives and be miserable?
Why cant I be in control of MY OWN thought process….why do I have to BELIEVE I am Power less….? I should be able to change a thought whenever I want to. Its MY MIND…
Why do I have to listen to a SPONSOR say “suggest” when they really mean “you better DO WHAT I SAY….OR ELSE!!”
Why does AA encourage us to be VICTIMS over and over again?Aren’t I a SURVIVOR?
Why when I purge my problems do 10 other members from different groups call me to sympathize….?I thought it was ANONYMOUS.
Why do people say they are “recovering catholics?”..Isnt AA a religion too. The 12 steps are like the 12 commandments…
And I could go on and on.
Oh and WHY is there a story in the Big Book about a guy who 12 steps a woman then marries her after her 1 year….isnt dating and 13 stepping against Aa..
Why did Bill Wilson have to be monitored for 13 stepping?
Why is Lois never given any credit when she helped Bill write most of AA Literature.
Why dont we look at the fact that Bill had an affair most of his married with his secretary
Why dont people get upset with Bill for ruining Lois life and losing her ancestral home.
WHY DO PEOPLE WANT TO STAY INTHE SHAME CHAIR for the rest of their lives.
Why is it comical when someone tells stories of their hateful and embarrassing acts?
Why in a country of FREEDOM and FREEDOM OF SPEECH do we chain ourselves to a shame chair then sit in guilt and judgement?
Make your own conclusion.
For entertainment purposes only…because I am POWERLESS OVER MY RANTS. And thats OK…
These comments of pure ignorance are laughable at best.. Did someone in AA bully you? If they did that is very sad but bullies are everywhere the walls of AA don’t make perfection and people don’t claim perfectionism that go there I would hope! I believe however someone chooses to
stop using drugs is their choice it doesn’t have to be AA or NA and for those that choose 12 step programs that’s great too .. Whatever works in an addicts life to change self destructive insidious mind obsessive diseased behaviors then why do you care? Live your life … When others compare people in AA or NA to Isis there is a serious ignorance within them… Sorry if people not slamming poison in their veins or snorting garbage in there nares or drinking til their liver shuts down anymore bothers you is utterly disgusting to me … Leave addicts alone they have suffered enough and you judging the way they get clean is actually bullying so as you try to use your intellect as a defense mechanism your actually seen as a uneducated scared truly insulting individual who needs some love in their life
The only reason addicts suffer is because of people like you who make them confess they have a disease caused by their ‘character defects’. Then you make them confess their sins with ‘rigorous honesty’ and then you abuse and exploit them and call them ‘ignorant’ if they protest. BTW, thanks for demonstrating how it works. And if by ‘love in your life’ you mean insulting and bullying someone until they overdose and die, then no thank you I don’t need any of that. It’s all yours.
Your twisted I love how you try to get people going … I myself don’t make any individual do anything.. You know nothing but keep speaking about something weird?? Because if you actually suffered what you speak you would know .. Don’t tell me the only way I suffered is by people telling me to confess my character defects which were created to hide my suffering… You know nothing of my suffering and I know nothing of yours .. So speak your truth not mine .. And stop living off the tales of others woes you know nothing of.. My suffering started long before and substance was added to my condition … Keep love in your heart and peace in your words your life may be better .. It may not … But it’s worth a try … And try to speak only what you know not what you hear if you don’t live it don’t speak it …
My truth says you’re a bully as you’ve just demonstrated right here. If anyone challenges your cult nonsense you say they should shut up because you’ve been through ‘suffering’. Well guess what everyone’s been through suffering. Just post your drunkalog it would prove all my points one after the other. Of course, you won’t. You’ll probably even deny being a member of AA. You will all deny her.
Your the bully and you’ve proven it in your blogs I would never leave my story on your page … You should be careful what you are saying and to who because you could cause some serious harm telling mothers of sons that have died from overdosing that their son wasn’t an addict… Do you know the meaning of the word? Because every word has a meaning if you don’t like the meaning then maybe you should find a different explanation … Then you tell people withdrawal isn’t really that bad …? Do you know this because you used drugs? If so why did you go through withdrawal if you weren’t addicted?? Withdrawal from alcohol can be deadly so unless you are a doctor stop giving deadly advice on your blogs … So glad you have barely any followers or someone may die from believing such ignorant words and denial … People are people where ever you go Na AA OA CA ect ect these are just people in a room at the same time why do people expect perfectionism from them if you say drugs weren’t the problem then why when they put them down do you expect them to be perfect?? And to say that crimes aren’t committed because of drugs is baffling to me … You are the bully of those trying to stay away from drugs trying to get people who are suffering from this plague to think it’s ok to keep putting drugs into there bodies and it is ok but there will be consequences .. Have you ever seen someone die that kept drinking and using drugs … It’s not pretty to see their body fill up with fluid because their liver shut down … Or see them wither away to nothing until there heart stops …. Drugs legal or not cause drastic consequences when you take them and for you to say otherwise is just a lack of knowledge and visualization of the death that occurs due to it
AM doesn’t the christian church demand that you confess your sins?
Seriously? Are you now selling indulgences at AA? Wow.
The only thing meeting makers make is more meetings.
Bitterness must not be exercised as it just rotten someone from the inside out. Maybe AA didn’t work for you but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t work also to other people. Addiction Treatment needs to undergo the process with competent facilities, guidance of the certified counselors and experts, and of course, the decision of the abuser as the first step to totally end his or her addiction.
12 steppers love to act as if it is a “given” that anyone who doesn’t buy their ideology is bitter, basically because there is no evidence that alcoholism/addiction is a real disease or that the 12 steps can treat – or even improve – the situation of people who wind up at their meetings, so it’s attack the strawman they hope everyone will believe is the critics of AA.
As for “addiction treatment” – almost all the rehab in the U.S. is just a conduit for 12 steps to be spread to new people – most have group talking sessions just like 12 step meetings and only allow 12 step reading material (& maybe the bible) and once they’ve completed the “program” they’re sent to 12 step groups.
I have been to many AA and NA meetings where I did not agree with everything being said. We alcoholics and addicts have been on a twisted path with twisted thoughts. We are flawed humans that contain our share of bull shit. But this Addiction Myth is a consummate bull shitter and master builder of this monu-mental bash blog. Congratulations dude, you have done for bull shit what Stonehenge did for rocks. Unfortunately, what you build with your rancid resentments and hatred,.. will not endure.
You are saying he “substituted negative for positive thinking.” You show you drank the Koolaid by saying “we” which most likely points to your need to feel safe by being included. As Trish was saying anyone who won’t drink the koolaid (believe in your dangerous mind control cult) is bitter, or any number of other names. (you used a few). When you can’t make sense in an argument go for the personal attack, common enough tactic among women (sorry girls), liberals and cult members.
As saved my life .
The pope of England what?
I’m certainly glad hundreds of thousands of people are sitting around embellishing their drinking exploits on any given Friday night rather than driving drunk killing people.
Your axe has been ground, move on.
Start another blog or something where you’re not rehashing your stale opinions.
As usual, threaten to kill people if they don’t buy into your psycho religious cult. You people are worse than ISiS.
No, I don’t mean you are wordy, I mean that this post is short but sums it up well.
Thanks. 🙂
I meant to add, that they also say, “Oh bullying never happens at AA and if it did I would say something” and then when it happens they just pile on!
A good short post but right to the point. “Addicts” view themselves as superior to other people, and their” addiction” is their expression of their perceived superiority.
Can you cite the scientific source for this claim? Otherwise, it’s just another fairytale with no evidence to back it up.
That’s patr, long time fan. I agree with him though I think he’s implying I can be a bit wordy. 🙂
Hey, AM, there’s an article you’ll probably love on The Atlantic (If you haven’t seen it already)
http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2015/03/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/
The craziest thing is that drugs &/or alcohol are blamed for creating negative behaviors & traits : lying, stealing (usually claimed to be done to “pay for drugs”), slacking at work/not working, cheating on lovers, committing crimes – even when the person has none of these “substances” in their system. And when they abstain, but do it without 12 steps/rehab, those traits supposedly persist. Even the heaviest users of heroin – or alcohol – spend many hours a day with none of their preferred substance in their bodies. But magically, the “influence” continues even without anything in their blood/brain. It’s even more potent that homeopathic remedies!
People who use drugs/alcohol and have any of the above traits/behaviors are labeled “out of control”. But it takes a lot of control to do some of these negative things – cheat on a lover? Requires constructing lies and schedules that keep the cheated-on person from discovering the truth. Embezzling from work to support a habit (often gambling)? Again, this requires a lot of well-thought out plans to deceive people not only face-to-face, but also to cook the books so the theft isn’t discovered. And what about going “out of control” and committing domestic violence? Why is it the “out of control” person always seems to attack someone available in the home, less likely to report/more likely to forgive – and no one goes “out of control” in a violent attack against some 6 foot something stranger – or maybe a uniformed cop – in public?
Nope – these people are perfectly in control of their behavior. It’s just part of the manipulation game that they claim to not have control of themselves – it distracts from the fact that they are trying to control everyone else.
Absolutely. It’s the power of self-deception and/or self-manipulation. “The devil made me do it!” I know you don’t believe in the devil but in this case it doesn’t matter what you believe 🙂
Now college students are taught that ‘addiction and mental illness are the root causes of violence’.
http://agentofchange.net/demo.html
You’re right I don’t believe in the devil, but I absolutely believe that people can come to believe that the Devil made them do it.
Oh, and I was thinking of another bit of AA “wisdom” (which they love to say Albert Einstein said, but he never did) – that doing the same thing, expecting a different result is “insanity”.
I would suggest another term for that behavior is “Practice”.
My word, such phobic exaggeration. You must be a very lonely , rejected man to be so bitter. AA might not be the answer, but life is. Maybe you should get one.
Exactly. Thank you.
So getting a life is an alternative to going to meetings to convince oneself that one has an “incurable, deadly disease”, that makes one out-of-control (unless one needs to lie, cheat or sneak around to get one’s own way) and listen to people trying to outdo each other with the biggest sin-to-redemption stories?
I bet a lot of people would absolutely prefer to “get a life” compared to the alternative.
Who needs a life when your life can be “meetings meetings meetings.” With a level of enlightenment that can give birth to brilliance like “meeting makers make it” it’s hard to imagine anyone could need anything else.
Right on, FattyZ!